A Knight's Tale: Stephen King said "(He) has become a kind of hero to those of us who write tales of terror and suspense. He is, quite simply, one of the best in the business." Who is this scribe knighted by "the King," and how does he feel about all the lofty praise bestowed upon him? Read Josh Jabcuga's interview to find out more.
February 3, 2005
Josh Jabcuga, Moviepoopshoot.com:
Let’s start with the whole Stephen King deal. You know I’m itchin’ to start there. Stephen King is a household name. He’s written some of the finest novels in the past century, and anyone who says otherwise isn’t worth their library card. In the horror community, though, he’s like the literary Elvis, really, both in terms of critical and commercial success. A true, living icon. Hell, the man probably has more gold than Fort Knox, and it’s a statistical fact that one in every two people on the planet Earth has read a Stephen King book from cover to cover. Actually, I just made up those figures, but you catch my drift.
So here’s this legend, who has been a supporter and flat-out fan of your work for quite some time, and he gets up to accept the Medal for Distinguished Contribution to American Letters from the National Book Foundation. Upon hearing this, my first reaction was, “Wow, one of our guys actually won!” The equivalent of, I dunno, the Crypt Keeper getting a seat in Congress, right? But then Mr. King goes on to praise your work during his speech, and says that you, along with Clive Barker, “remade the face of American popular fiction and yet very few people here will have an idea of who I’m talking about or have read the work.”
You were in attendance that night. Did you know ahead of time about your inclusion in King’s speech? Secondly, was it bittersweet in the sense that, yeah, King is right, I don’t always get the recognition I may deserve, but shit, I’ve just been anointed by “the King.” Knowing your track record and the decisions you've made as a writer, I doubt you needed that validation, or any validation for that matter, as an artist, but still, how did it make you feel, knowing Uncle Stevie was vouching for you at this stuffy event?
Jack Ketchum:
There's nobody writing today I admire more than Stephen King. On a lot of levels. If he's the literary Elvis in terms of success he deserves to be. As a writer, he's brought not just horror, but an entire style of writing -- personal, direct, a "dear reader" sensibility, almost harkening back to the Victorian, the Dickensian, back into our canon. His range is immense and he's fearless, he's not afraid to tackle anything. And he's always expanding that range. Read 'SALEM'S LOT and then read HEARTS IN ATLANTIS or GREEN MILE. The voice is utterly recognizable, and spooky as ever, yet look where it's gone. As he gets older he gets more introspective, and bolder, and wiser, more into character than effect. Characters like you and me. Like Elvis was, he's a goddamn national treasure, and reflects us at every turn.
Then there's the guy himself. The night of the National Book Awards I was simply floored to be there period, for free, at Steve's invite, in a jerry-built tuxedo -- the first I've ever owned, half donated by a buddy of mine who'd gained a little too much weight and half purchased at Paul Stuart and Filene's Basement -- sitting with Peter and Susan Straub and Evan Hunter and his lady and Paula, my companion since 1970, and all of a sudden Steve starts talking about me, and Peter, saying stuff like, "Straub and Ketchum have arguably written among the best books of their career" (referencing Peter's LOST BOY LOST GIRL and my THE CROSSINGS) and saying to the audience "have you read them?" I remember Peter turning to me grinning and shaking his head as if to say, "that's Steve," and Paula turning to me sotto vocce saying, "Dallas, shut your mouth!" because mine was wide open in total surprise.
Point is -- generosity of spirit. There was no need for Steve to share his moment. He'd earned it, as you say. He was sick as a dog anyway with walking pneumonia and went into the hospital the following day to have his lungs drained. This was life-threatening, folks, this was really serious. But he stood there and handed us part of his garland that night, shared it, and I'll never forget it. When I grow up I want to be just like Stephen King.
Josh Jabcuga:
King also made a point that night to say this whole “genre versus non genre literary battle” is tired. I agree with him there. In my opinion it’s real old. King added, “Nor do I have any patience with or use for those who make a point of pride in saying they’ve never read anything by John Grisham, Tom Clancy, Mary Higgins Clark or any popular writer.”
Obviously, we’d all be hypocrites if we didn’t agree with the man, but there’s a part of me that is a bit more jaded. There’s a part of me that says, “Yeah, OK, by mentioning Grisham and Clancy and Higgins Clark he just took role call in the exclusive Multimillionaire Authors Club.” The same part of me that thinks, maybe, just maybe, if the local book store’s shelves weren’t cluttered with a zillion copies of the latest from Clancy or Grisham or yes, even King, maybe other writers would be getting more exposure, and maybe readers would have an easier time saying, “Hey, I’ve never heard of this guy but the book looks good so I’ll give it a whirl,” because all the promotional money for the ad campaigns and hype and the budget for placement of the product on store shelves wouldn’t be thrown into the latest releases from the Multimillionaire Authors Club, who are pretty much guaranteed to sell anyway. I guess it’s the same part of me that says, “Shit, you know, if these publishing houses spread out their money a little more, took chances on new writers, or gave them time to grow and find an audience over the course of four or five books, maybe it’d be easier for new people to break in, maybe even me.” It’s part of living in the age of mega corporations though. Either way, that’s kind of elitist on my own end, I admit, when instead I should be grateful to King for really blazing the trail.
You’re a successful author. You’ve made a nice living from your efforts. And you’ve seen the business from both sides over multiple decades. I’m wondering what your take is on the whole scene? Should people resent the Clancys and Kings and the rest? Is there any bitterness towards these mass-produced, commercial darlings on your end, or at the very least, do you appreciate where this type of mentality is coming from?
Jack Ketchum:
When I was just coming up as a pro writer one of my first ongoing jobs was for CREEM magazine, a pretty neat rock 'n roll magazine. I reviewed records and my basic stance was, if you can't like this thing, don't write about it. Why trash somebody who's working in the arts when you can trash business, the government? Save your vitriol for people who are out to hurt you. I guess I felt we needed appreciation in the arts more than criticism. So I'd turn down stuff I really didn't like. I'd write about stuff I did like but which maybe had holes in it and I'd point that out. I did stuff on Elvis, Cher, Patti Smith, X, Willie Nelson -- not necessarily loving it but trying to put in context -- what, today, was their offering? Against a total appreciation of their product. To me, warts are just fine -- as long as the overall complexion is good.
I don't resent the "Multimillionaire Club" as you put it. Hell, I cut my teeth early on with Harold Robbins (A STONE FOR DANNY FISHER was big in my youth as was William Goldman's YOUR TURN TO CURTSY, MY TURN TO BOW and John Farris' HARRISON HIGH, all bestsellers.) I dislike bad writing -- but hell, I don't have to buy or read it. I can see it coming in the first paragraph usually and put it away. But I don't have to recommend it. Or knock it. I'd rather have people reading casually -- even the simple stuff -- than not reading at all. I don't expect everybody to have read MOBY DICK. But the magic of reading it seems to me is that once you're hooked, once you're into it, it expands you more often than not, it gives you a kind of ambition -- "If I can read this, then maybe I can also read that!" And at some point you say, Shakespeare, what the fuck. I'll give it a shot.
Josh Jabcuga:
Your work has been labeled as “pornographic violence,” which, for better or worse, might scare off some people, and maybe rightfully so. It’s safe to say that it’s probably not for everyone. And a little bit of controversy can be good, I’m sure, but then you’ve said maybe people are missing the boat. One of the greatest compliments you’ve ever received, you’ve said, came from Peter Straub, who felt people read you for all the wrong reasons. You explained that they come to you for the shock value, “splatterpunk” as it's often labeled, yet they miss out on the substance, or they decide to stick around because of the substance. Do you ever feel as if your books are unfairly categorized or criticized? What I mean to say is, I’ve seen some pretty violent and pornographic R-rated films at the local multiplex, yet they mainly sneak under the radar. C’mon, have you seen some of Tarantino’s stuff? It’s brutal, really well done, but still brutal. And yeah, QT’s had his share of finger-pointing in his direction, but for the most part, America adores the guy. I find it really odd to hear accounts of readers finding certain books of yours in Barnes and Noble shrink-wrapped, for the public’s safety or whatever.
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Jack Ketchum:
Shrink-wrapped? That's a new one on me. That I gotta see. But I certainly wouldn't put it past our moral guardians. I don't think the phrase "pornographic violence" applies here much, though. If you want to think that about my stuff, go ahead -- at least I've gotten your attention. But I think it's sloppy thinking. Pornography doesn't interest me much unless it's some of that real wacked-out stuff on the internet. And I trust my interest there will fade too once the novelty wears off and I stop shaking my head in wonder. I'm one of these types who, unless it's really well done, usually fast-forwards through the sex scenes in movies on my VCR. Ho-hum. Nice tits. BO-ring. I do often write about sexual violence, which is not the same thing as pornography but unfortunately part of life, seemingly endemic to the condition. Read about any war in modern times and along with the exploded heads and severed limbs you'll also be reading about rape, torture and sexual violence. I guarantee it. Sexual violence seems to happen whenever small-minded people get too much power into their hands and that happens a lot. Whether it's a husband over his battered wife or the president of Liberia over an entire country. And I think it's wholly proper and probably salutary to write about that. People who'd rather not be reminded can read elsewhere.
Josh Jabcuga:
Obviously, certain things have no place in our society, and could never be considered “art,” no matter how one was to view them. Off the top of my head, I’m thinking something like child pornography or animal cruelty, these clearly have no place and there should be zero tolerance for them in culture or society. Other things though, while they may be tasteless or even lacking any real artistic merit, aren’t necessarily wrong or worthy of censorship. Especially with Bush in office, it seems like the Arts are being more carefully scrutinized, and movie studios, record labels, and book publishers are approaching things with more caution than ever.
You’ve dealt with censorship in the past, some would say you were even a victim of it. Where do you stand on censorship in today’s society?
Jack Ketchum:
I was a victim of only minor censorship. It stuck in my craw even so. One of my heroes growing up was Henry Miller, who would have none of it. (I also want to grow up to be Henry Miller.) A censor almost by definition is someone who keeps something from us, who limits us, not just thought, but enough rice to eat or clean water -- another goddamn power-monger. A censor is a fucking bully. How to you deal with a bully? If you're lucky and big, you flatten the sucker right there on the playground. If you're small and weak, you stay out of his way and work around his edges. Or, you can outlast him. Outlast the dopey bombast and bullshit. That's what Miller did. What Joyce did. They waited and the time got right and people got a little sane and they won. I got censored, and as soon as I could -- which really didn't take all that long in the scheme of things -- put all the stuff back. See the UNEXPURGATED OFF SEASON or the revised SHE WAKES. Stealth and patience can still defeat the long guns.
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Josh Jabcuga:
You mention Overlook releasing the UNEXPURGATED OFF SEASON. Has that given you any closure? Did it put an end to a particular chapter in your life?
Jack Ketchum:
Absolutely. It's now the book I can really stand behind. The one I really wrote in the first place.
Next week: The Rights to Write: In the conclusion of our interview, Jack Ketchum takes all of us would-be hacks to school!
Visit Jack Ketchum's official website:
www.JackKetchum.net
Visit "The Hotel of Horror, Science, & Mystery," The Overlook Connection, to purchase books by Jack Ketchum:
www.overlookconnection.com
Another superb source to find a Ketchum fix, Gauntlet Press:
www.gauntletpress.com
Praise for the writing of Josh Jabcuga, who pens Squib Central, published every Thursday, exclusively at www.moviepoopshoot.com:
“Josh Jabcuga can take the 26 measly letters of our crude alphabet and capture the bi-polar soul of all that is classically yet disturbingly American. Then, when his typewriter is left to cool, he can turn right around…completely ready to trounce any drunk punk that’s got me backed into a corner.” –The Colonel J.D. Wilkes of The Legendary Shack*Shakers.
Press kits, promos, items for consideration to be reviewed in Squib Central should be sent to:
Josh Jabcuga
3910 Sharondale Dr.
Hamburg, NY 14075
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